When a Colorado member was confronted by two angry men in a grocery store parking lot, he tried to defuse the situation by showing his firearm. Watch Member Ambassador Sherry Hale explain why our Member got arrested — and learn the simple step you can take to avoid a similar fate.
Texas Law Shield Independent Program Attorney Gordon Cooper says that words alone are not enough to justify use of force or deadly force in an escalating situation. But couple them with a threatening action, and it’s a whole ‘nother ballgame. Click to watch the video:You might have read some articles or seen headlines about a court upholding a ban on “assault rifles,” including the AR-15. Independent Program Attorneys at the law firm of Walker & Byington, PLLC have received many questions from Members concerned that this ruling has made the AR-15 (and similar semi-automatic firearms) illegal “assault weapons” everywhere in the country. Is this the truth of the matter, or a case of media misinformation?
Since when are verbal threats enough to escalate to brandishing a weapon? I think this is spin BS–in fact, the guys that “verbally assaulted” him would have been justified in blowing Scott’s butt away after he produced a weapon IMO lacking any evidence that they presented any credible threat of serious bodily injury or death. Had he attempted to retreat and was able to prove that he had no other option MAYBE he might have had a chance to prove possible expectation of imminent threat.
You don’t have to take a punch before you know the fight is on. Once punches are thrown, a firearm is usually not as effective as rational thought is out the window.
This wasn’t a piece on defending Scott’s honor. It was to advise members of the fact that police are reactive, and criminal know this and LIE to avoid jail themselves.
How do the police know it’s a lie prior to collected evidence/testimony? Other than a sketchy call–they can only go by what they find at the scene and try to apply procedure. People can scream “i’m going to beat you up , blow you away..whatever” that STILL does not justify brandishing a weapon in a manner that can be construed as imminent threat of bodily injury or death. The message is not call first–the message should be “don’t be stupid and produce a weapon just because someone is in your face screaming at you. I still think this guy is lucky he didn’t end up charged and in jail.
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So your should wait until your on the ground getting stomped on before u react ?
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The burden off proof is going to be on you to prove to a jury that they would do the same thing as you if they were in your position. Getting a bloody nose, punched out etc. does not necessarily give you a pass to escalate to a threat of deadly force–because that’s what we’re talking about here. If that were the case homicides would be in the hundreds of thousands, because fights, insults, threats etc happen all the time. You guys need to consult with legal authorities who are familiar with the law–including the originator of this thread, IMO, or you’re going to end up in a whole lot of trouble potentially–regardless of when you call LE.
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The whole message is lost on submoa. Good thing he knows more than a bunch of legal experts.
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If you really are in fear for your life best approach is not to use your weapon to threaten but rather to kill both of them. The threat is a crime. The use is justified in many states by current self defense doctrines. If they were both dead there would be two less people to lie in court. I was taught to use a weapon by an old Marine who survived several Pacific landings. He advised never to draw a weapon unless you had already decided to kill the enemy. It was good advice in the 40s and still is.
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M 0 Man–I made no such claims at all–in fact what I distinctly said was seek local legal advice. You want to wander around in public with a concealed carry and produce it anytime someone gets in your face–have at it. Find one active LE officer that is willing to publicly proclaim here that this is a good idea I will gladly retract my statements as pure wambly-pambly nonsemse.
Since when are verbal threats enough to escalate to brandishing a weapon? I think this is spin BS–in fact, the guys that “verbally assaulted” him would have been justified in blowing Scott’s butt away after he produced a weapon IMO lacking any evidence that they presented any credible threat of serious bodily injury or death. Had he attempted to retreat and was able to prove that he had no other option MAYBE he might have had a chance to prove possible expectation of imminent threat.
You don’t have to take a punch before you know the fight is on. Once punches are thrown, a firearm is usually not as effective as rational thought is out the window.
This wasn’t a piece on defending Scott’s honor. It was to advise members of the fact that police are reactive, and criminal know this and LIE to avoid jail themselves.
How do the police know it’s a lie prior to collected evidence/testimony? Other than a sketchy call–they can only go by what they find at the scene and try to apply procedure. People can scream “i’m going to beat you up , blow you away..whatever” that STILL does not justify brandishing a weapon in a manner that can be construed as imminent threat of bodily injury or death. The message is not call first–the message should be “don’t be stupid and produce a weapon just because someone is in your face screaming at you. I still think this guy is lucky he didn’t end up charged and in jail.
So your should wait until your on the ground getting stomped on before u react ?
The burden off proof is going to be on you to prove to a jury that they would do the same thing as you if they were in your position. Getting a bloody nose, punched out etc. does not necessarily give you a pass to escalate to a threat of deadly force–because that’s what we’re talking about here. If that were the case homicides would be in the hundreds of thousands, because fights, insults, threats etc happen all the time. You guys need to consult with legal authorities who are familiar with the law–including the originator of this thread, IMO, or you’re going to end up in a whole lot of trouble potentially–regardless of when you call LE.
The whole message is lost on submoa. Good thing he knows more than a bunch of legal experts.
If you really are in fear for your life best approach is not to use your weapon to threaten but rather to kill both of them. The threat is a crime. The use is justified in many states by current self defense doctrines. If they were both dead there would be two less people to lie in court. I was taught to use a weapon by an old Marine who survived several Pacific landings. He advised never to draw a weapon unless you had already decided to kill the enemy. It was good advice in the 40s and still is.
M 0 Man–I made no such claims at all–in fact what I distinctly said was seek local legal advice. You want to wander around in public with a concealed carry and produce it anytime someone gets in your face–have at it. Find one active LE officer that is willing to publicly proclaim here that this is a good idea I will gladly retract my statements as pure wambly-pambly nonsemse.